Vice President Agnew on Agnew

Spiro T. Agnew is both weapon and target in this election year. Last week, between campaign forays, he took time out to discuss this dual role, with its problems and rewards, with TIME Correspondents Hugh Sidey and John Stacks. Seated in his luxurious suite in the Executive Office Building, a white marble bust of Socrates staring over his shoulder, the Vice President was tanned from a weekend of tennis in Palm Springs. But he looked and sounded a little weary, and as he spoke, he showed a curious mixture of nearly self-righteous assurance about the accuracy of his charges and an almost sad sense of his own fallibility.

I'M not aware of why I'm so controversial. But when I look back, controversy has followed me. I was controversial in Baltimore County; I was a controversial Governor. A lot of it comes from being in a minority party. You have to be aggressive. It is high-risk politics. I have always played high-risk politics. I guess I always will, and it is a lot more fun and a lot more effective.

I'm not trying for an image. I'm not campaigning for myself; I'm campaigning for others. I'm out taking the message to the people. My role is the same as the one Vice President Nixon played for President Eisenhower. It is a purely political role of being the partisan spokesman for the Administration in an election year.

I don't think people are impressed with histrionics, with wild gesticulating. They come to hear what you say, and I want them to hear the words. I worry about the content, and if the mood strikes me I'll use more alliteration. I also like metaphors. But I don't need gimmicks to get my message across.

I am simply stating what America is all about. I guess it is a holdover from what my father taught me. He had very firm opinions on what was good and what was bad. I guess when you come from another country, like my father did, you sometimes have a better view.

When Agnew was Governor of Maryland he was characterized as a liberal. Has he changed?

Life is a question of emphasis, really. I haven't changed one view since the time I was thought to be a liberal. If the issues under debate today were housing, water pollution and tax reform, I would come out with high liberal marks. If the issues yesterday had been violence and disruption and desecrating of the flag, I would have had high conservative marks. When I was Governor, I strongly supported Lyndon Johnson when there was a gubernatorial effort to rally support against the war. It is a matter of where the emphasis is.

I don't think I'm more sacrosanct than any radical-liberal because my philosophy differs. I have never had a head-to-head encounter where the opposition hasn't scored some points. In that debate with the college kids [on the David Frost Show], I found out they are really highly motivated. They are not simply looking for publicity. But I don't think they have the depth of experience to speak with such assurance.

Does Agnew like campaigning?

Oh, yeah, it's enjoyable. Particularly since the response is so good. I like the handshaking. I guess it grows on you. I didn't like it as well when I first started out. And it takes a little doing. But when you see me go to those airport fences, it is out of choice more than design.

I have my up points and my down points. I don't know before I start if I'm going to do well. I may feel fine, but I may be down. The first appearances after days off tend to be down. It might take two speeches to get back up. Fatigue can be a factor, especially after too many crises.

I think I can tell you what I like least about campaigning. It is those small periods of time between events that are totally lost, where it is impossible to do anything. A half-hour here, a half-hour there. You do not want to clutter your mind before a speech; you cannot break away to relax. These are lost moments.

What I've noticed most in America is that the people are as friendly and outgoing and warm as we have always been led to believe. We are a homogeneous country. I don't find much sectionalism. There is some of that feeling in the South, but that is understandable, and they are trying to get rid of it. The South has been made a whipping boy too long.

And politically, we are making headway. I can tell by the strength of the response from the other side. You can tell when the target has been hit. If we go by past history, anything better than losing 30 House seats and breaking even in the Senate would mean success.

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